For years, Seth has been searching for a mystical experience that might reveal something extraordinary about his life. A Jewish educator and musician, he looks for encounters with the divine through music, prayer, and eventually psychedelic retreats, hoping for the kind of revelation that changed the lives of biblical prophets. But what happens when the experience you've been longing for turns out to be nothing like you imagined? A surprising and deeply personal story about the search for meaning, the desire for certainty, and what it takes to encounter the sacred.
SHOW NOTES
[1] Citation: Exodus 2:4 ““His sister stationed herself at a distance, to know what would befall him”
[2] Citation: Leviticus 10:1 “Now Aaron’s sons Nadav and Abihu each took his fire pan, put fire in it, laid incense in it and they offered before God (Esh Zara) alien fire, which had not been enjoined upon them.”
[3] Leviticus Rabbah discusses reasons for the death of Nadav and Abihu, among them, intoxication. Here is a strong article articulating the different stories around what the sages thought about Esh Zara and subsequent loss of life.
[4] Citation: Yerushalmi, Kiddushin 4:12 “You will one day give reckoning for everything your eyes saw which, although permissible, you did not enjoy"
[5] ummm… tell me more about psychedelic retreats! Shefa, a Jewish psychedelic community, offers a variety of retreats that utilize psilocybin in therapeutic and responsible ways sourced in Jewish wisdom.
[6] Citation: 2 Kings 3:15 “Now then, get me a musician.As the musician played, GOD’s hand came upon him.”
[7] Citation on Miriam’s vision are a mashup between Sotah 13a and Exodus Rabbah 1:22 where we read, “"My mother is destined to give birth to a son who will save Israel from Egyptian bondage." Here’s a quick article outlining the different early stories about Miriam’s prophecies.
[8] If you want to learn more about Miriam as a prophet and leader of the Jewish people, you might enjoy Jericho Vincent’s podcast “Survival guide for a spiritual wilderness”
[9] Citation: Genesis 28:16 “God was in this place and I did not know”
[10] Seth refers to the psilocybin retreats as “Journey work” here is a link to a place that uses the same terminology.
[11] Citation: Taanit 9a (Rashi on Numbers 20:2) “...during the entire forty years they had the “well” through Miriam’s merit.”
[12] Citation: Pirkei Avot 5:6 “Ten things were created on the eve of the Sabbath at twilight, and these are they: [1] the mouth of the earth, [2] the mouth of the well, [3] the mouth of the donkey, [4] the rainbow, [5] the manna, [6] the staff [of Moses], [7] the shamir, [8] the letters, [9] the writing, [10] and the tablets. And some say: also the demons, the grave of Moses, and the ram of Abraham, our father. And some say: and also tongs, made with tongs”
[13] If you or someone you love is struggling with addiction, consider Tikvah Center, a Jewish recovery center, Rabbi Kerry Olitzky's vast library of resources and Rami Shapiro’s book “Recovery- the sacred art- The 12 steps as a spiritual practice.”
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MIRIAM: When we tell the story of the Exodus, Moses is our central character. We follow his story to the burning bush, into Pharaoh’s palace, through the parted sea and out into the wilderness. But before any of those moments, Moses is baby, born into a family with siblings. We read about a girl who plants herself beside a river watching a basket drift through the reeds, carrying her baby brother towards an unknown future. At this point in the Torah, she is a girl without a name.
וַתֵּתַצַּ֥ב אֲחֹת֖וֹ מֵרָחֹ֑ק לְדֵעָ֕ה מַה־יֵּעָשֶׂ֖ה לֽוֹ׃ Ve-tetatzav achoto me-rachok lede’a ma ye’aseh lo“
“His sister stationed herself at a distance, to know what would befall him”
Just “his sister.” We know her as Miriam. Eventually we will know her as a prophetess. But in the beginning, her role is to stand to the side, keeping watch over her brother, who will take on the central role of the story.
Today’s mystic, Seth, is a pursuer of prophecy. Or, at least he was for a very long time. He wanted a vision big enough to hand him his purpose. He chased it in music, community, Jewish study, and the occasional psychedelic journey. After years of searching for revelation, he eventually finds it. In ways both grander and smaller than his seeking mind could ever imagine.
[THEME MUSIC]
MIRIAM: Welcome to Everyday Mystics, where we believe that the story of Moses awakening to his call through a burning bush that could not be consumed, is not just a one of a kind, once upon a time story, but rather a map for our own lives. Each of us has a story or stories of untold wonder that break and shape the humans we become. We call these people, everyday mystics. In this podcast we tell stories of Jewish people who stumble across burning bushes and come away seeing Judaism differently. I’m Miriam Terlinchamp, and these are stories of the moments when the everyday becomes sacred, the familiar becomes mysterious, and Judaism becomes beautifully unbound.
A content warning for today’s episode, this episode includes conversations about drug use.
MIRIAM: The story begins a long time ago, Seth is in his 20’s on a hike in the woods with his buddy. They walk deep into the forest. They’ve just taken psychedelic mushrooms and Seth wants to commune with nature. Nature, as it turns out, has a lot of other people in it.
SETH: And I say at one point, hey, why don't we try each of us like, you know, doing a little bit of like introspection and alone time and communing with nature and see how that goes. And he's like, Great. So we go, you know, like maybe like, you know, 30 feet away from each other, just like to the point where we can't see each other….Sitting there for like 30 seconds and I'm starting to get like nervous. Like, is he all right? Like where he is? And I'm like, Hey, are you are you okay? And he's like, Yeah, man, I'm great. I'm I'm doing fine. Like, okay. And like maybe 30 seconds goes by, and he's like, Hey, are you okay? Are you all right? Or you are? And I'm like, Yeah, yeah, I'm good. I was just checking on you. Literally, this goes back and forth like a half a dozen times every 30 seconds.
MIRIAM: They check on each other beautifully, but communing with the universe proves harder.
SETH: So I knew there was some potential for something more, but this was not the way to get there.
MIRIAM: For the purposes of this episode, we’re calling today’s everyday mystic, Seth, in an effort to protect his identity. Seth is a Jewish educator, a husband and a father. And talking about the psychedelics as a tool for a Jewish vision, practice, and for the betterment of personal well being, still is controversial. Yet, the desire and pursuit of a clear vision is something that all of us can recognize. Seth spends years seeking out experiences that will crack the world open and let him embrace what he’s been missing. In the Torah, Moses encounters a mystical vision with a burning bush that offers him a defined mission. Seth spends a lot of his life looking for encounters like that, experiences that shift and shape the way he sees the world.
[MUSICAL TRANSITION]
MIRIAM: As a teenager, Seth devours accounts of experiences that promise a whole new way of perceiving reality. He wants to know what that feels like.
SETH: And I was looking for, I wanted to commune with God. I wanted to, you know, experience nature. I wanted to see colors that I I hadn't seen before. I wanted to hear sounds, you know, talk talk to birds and understand the the the hidden messages in the wind. And, you know, like I I had this fantasy of what a psychedelic experience would be.
MIRIAM: Listen to what he wants: colors he’s never seen, sounds he’s never heard, messages hidden in the wind. He wants a different world from the one in front of him. Or, at least a different way of experiencing and appreciating the world in front of him. There’s a lot of reasons why someone might reach for a psychedelic encounter. It’s a way of intentionally altering our minds to manufacture an experience that lifts us out of the ordinary, out of the present, out of everything we already know. And, if you're like Seth, the purpose of that altering is to return us back to this world with new understanding and capacity for wonder.
SETH: I think psychedelics felt just like one of the pathways that I was like, "Is there some sort of there there around transcendent experience or connection to self or, you know, talking to God that I am going to potentially be able to get out of this pathway
Miriam: Our Jewish tradition gets this. On one hand, we are warned about pursuing these encounters, like in Leviticus, Aaron’s sons, Nadav and Avihu, rush into the sanctuary carrying “Esh Zara” “strange fire,” and the fire consumes them. One midrash says they entered drunk. They want the encounter so badly that they try to make it happen themselves. And, on the other hand, you can read in the Talmud (Kiddushin 4:12.) that in the afterlife, we will need to account for every permitted pleasure that we didn’t enjoy. Being present and in wonder at the world is an obligation. Seth wants the mystical wonder of an enlightened mind AND he also wants to balance staying in control, those two desires fight each other.
SETH: I was in a circle of friends who were, you know, dropping acid and doing mushrooms, but I, I never wanted to like let go of control to that degree. It w- was, it was frightening to me.
MIRIAM: He finds this tension within his Jewish life. His home, growing up, is secular, and there isn’t a lot of Jewish mysticism happening. But, in his teen years, Seth joins his synagogue youth group, and he discovers a love in Jewish music which takes him to a place spiritually shifting his understanding around connecting with the Divine.
SETH: It was the same sort of folk music, Pete Seeger, Bob Dylan kind of messages that I had grown up with and that my parents had introduced me to, Peter, Paul and Mary concerts, you know, Simon and Garfunkel,
[Recording or Seth]
SETH: that I was like, "Oh, these are-- there's, there's Hebrew words that are saying the same thing, and they're prayers, and I can pray in this way." And I became a song leader and played a lot of guitar in spaces where I was really seeing myself as able to get kids like jumping up and down enthusiastically and singing along.
MIRIAM: Those songs that feel like praying are powerful, and so he turns his attention to leading through them, becoming a song leader and building Jewish experiences with his guitar and voice for kids in his community. This fuels him. Works for him.
He grows up, gets married, and has kids. Continues to build a life as a Jewish educator. Things are good. And normal. But that deep yearning for something bigger, for something broader nags at him in the recesses of his spirit.
[MUSICAL TRANSITION]
MIRIAM: One day, Seth and his wife are hanging out with some friends, who are also parents and seemingly typical just like they are. This couple seems happier and more relaxed than Seth’s seen them in awhile. in their casual conversation the couple shares something that re-opens a desire that Seth hasn’t thought about in a long time.
SETH: And they're like, you know, in a total, like, whisper, they're like, "Listen, we've got something to tell you." And we're like, "Yes?" Like not having any idea what they're about to say. They're like, "We've been doing these natural plant medicine retreats, and they're amazing. They've changed our lives. They've changed our parenting, and we think you would love them." And we're like, "What are you talking about?" They're like, "Magic mushrooms."
MIRIAM: in other words, they’ve been going on psychedelic retreats. Seth never pictured these particular friends doing this. But what they describe seems familiar: people gather, share an experience, eat a meal together, and sit in a circle the next morning to talk it through.
SETH: which totally sounded to me like a youth group retreat, but with psychedelics. And I was like, wow, this is sounds amazing. You're absolutely right. Of course I'd be into this.
MIRIAM: Seth is in. What is most compelling, beyond the familiarity and the fun of the experience, is this notion that the retreats changed something for the couple. His wife, on the other hand, hesitates. She is unsure about these retreats for several reasons. But both of them want what their friends describe: a change in how they treat each other and how they parent.
SETH: You know, my wife and I, we, we met and got married. I was already in my late 30s. We met and got married, I was in, like, my mid-30s, and she was in her late 20s. And so we were already somewhat formed as people when we met, and we had a lot of love, but also a lot of friction. And so, you know, couples counseling was part of our life from even before we got married. And we had both, you know, had experiences of therapy previously that we had had good results from, and had mixed experiences of couples counseling that either didn't work for one or the other of us. And while there had been a lot of improvement in our communication, the relationship had had a lot of rockiness to it. And so he-- And, and our parenting, as much as we were like, "We think we're doing a pretty good job as parents," like, we love our kids, we're looking out for them, there also was, there was challenge. You know? It wasn't smooth.
SETH: If this is a vehicle that can help us to be better with each other and better with our kids than we currently are, this is this is really worth exploring.
MIRIAM: It takes a year to arrange their first visit. The retreat has a garden, a pool, and a row of lawn chairs. They settle in, take what’s offered, pull on eye masks, and lie back. Seth is ready for his revelation.
[MUSICAL TRANSITION]
SETH: And, you know, for the most part, I'm like lying there, just being like, this music is too loud and it's so insipid. And what it why am I even doing this? What am I getting out of this? This is such a waste of time.
MIRIAM: Wump wump. This is not a revelation. This is campy, and not in a good way. And now, Seth’s stuck there, with hours to tally up how little he’s getting out of this. The next morning, people go around the circle and share what happened to them. Seth listens with envy, jealous at the notion that everyone else seems like they got what they came for except him. When it comes time for Seth to share, he reaches for something to say, shifting past his expectations about what he thought he was going to get out of the experience, trying, instead, to find a glimpse of something meaningful from the night before.
SETH: I was gonna like have revealed what my life purpose was, or I was going to, you know, talk directly to God and have some kind of real clarity about what it all means and all the people in my life. And and it didn't feel like there was any of that.
MIRIAM: Which raises a question Seth wrestles with, and maybe you do too. Can you create the environment for a vision or does it need to come to you? And, if and when it does, does that vision “count” if something outside you helps bring it on, like a plant, a pill, or a cup of tea at a retreat? Does it have to come from God, unannounced, unmediated, in order to be real?
In the second book of Kings, the prophet Elisha needs to hear from God, and he doesn’t just sit and wait. In his need for clarity and communion with God, Elisha says, “Bring me a musician.” The musician plays, and the hand of God comes upon him. Even a prophet sometimes needs help getting there. Sometimes the mystical arrives on it’s own, and sometimes, one needs to craft circumstances for it to arrive. In this light, it’s less about where a vision comes from and more about where the vision takes you.
SETH: And but I had this moment.
SETH: Where instead of picturing myself as Moses as I'd hoped, I felt myself as Miriam and sitting on the bank of the Nile and watching my baby brother in a basket, like just f on the like putting my baby brother into the basket, putting him on the Nile, and then just kind of sitting there patiently at the shore…And watching to see what happens and being a witness, like being present fully for whatever it's going to be. Like, is this going to be the worst possible outcome? Is this going to be, you know, salvation? Like, what is going to happen? And living in that that liminal moment with just complete presence.
MIRIAM: He wants to be Moses and receive his purpose. Instead, he finds himself as Miriam beside the Nile. Back when she was just called sister, not yet a prophetess. And it feels uncomfortable for him, this embodiment of not knowing.
The rabbis of the Talmud say that Miriam had a vision too, and she had it first. Before Moses is born, she prophesied that her mother will give birth to the child who saves the people of Israel. When Moses is born, light fills the house, and their father, Amram, kisses Miriam on the head. Then when Pharaoh’s decree comes, and the family has to set that same baby adrift on the Nile, all but certain that he will die, Miriam’s father taps her on the head again, asking, “So where is your prophecy now?”
Miriam, wondering the same thing, goes down to the river to see what will become of her vision. She has already had her revelation. Now she does the work that follows vision, first through accompaniment, then through action.
For Seth, the image of himself as Miriam, at first, does not resonate. But as he talks it through with his companions at the retreat, he uncovers what the vision actually means to him.
SETH: The first was I think I was disappointed after the journey itself, like that evening. I was like, is this really all I get? Like I want to be Moses. And I'm like, you know, not I'm I'm like, you know, I wanted main character energy, right?
SETH: Then there was in the integration itself, like I became very emotional while sharing about this because I think there was a humility, a sense of like, why do I think Miriam's not a main character? Just because the story is told from the point of view of Moses as being the lead character. Like that's just the way the story's being told. Maybe, you know, from Miriam's perspective, she's the main character. And that was an important reframe.
MIRIAM: Why doesn’t Miriam count as the main character? The prophet Micah asks a similar question. Speaking to the people through God’s voice, Micah says: “I brought you up from the land of Egypt… and I sent before you Moses, Aaron, and Miriam.” There isn’t one hero. There are at least three!
For a Jewish educator who’s used to leading the room, the question about who is at the center of a story, gets to him. Seth starts to notice how often he walks up to other people already holding something he wants to make happen.
SETH: How often am I trying to, you know, push forward my agenda and not thinking about other people's agendas? And how often is my relationship with other people, what can you do for me? And not how can I be present?
SETH: with you. And so I think there really was, you know, an eye-opening aspect, even at the time, but it's only been as I've continued to engage in these sorts of experiences and start to lead them for others that it's been so clear to me that being able to witness without judgment to be fully present that that'sA huge part of what it means to go through life in a healthy and engaged way.
MIRIAM: He gets emotional as he shares. The image won’t let him go. Over time, he turns it into a mode of being in the world, presence with suspended judgement.
This is where the vision does its best work. It doesn’t carry Seth away from his life. It sends him back into it, helps him reframe and understand the world he already inhabits. Our ancestor Jacob knows this move. He lies down on a stone in the middle of nowhere and dreams of a ladder with angels climbing up and down. When he wakes up, Jacob looks around at the same dirt and the same rock, and says, “God is in this place, and I did not know it.” And then, in wonder, he says: mah nora ha-makom ha-zeh: “How awesome is this place.” That’s one of the jobs of awe. Awe helps us see the place where we’re already standing with new eyes. The greatest impact of a vision is when it sends us back to our own lives, our own land and our own people, helping us become better humans.
[MUSICAL TRANSITION]
MIRIAM: At home, the vision Seth has around presence gets tested. Seth and his wife love their children. They also hold strong convictions about how things should go. Sometimes they clash. Sometimes they close ranks.
SETH: places where we would butt heads is we would each be so certain our way of doing it was the right thing, or we'd be a hundred percent in agreement. We're right and our kid is wrong.
MIRIAM: Closing ranks can still leave somebody unheard. As they keep going to retreats and reflecting together, Seth notices himself changing.
SETH: We are so much better with our kids. And it boils down to like a very simple thing. It's about like not being as judgmental. Like it really, it's very straightforward, you know, coming in with curiosity and not assuming that you have the better answer, like just because you have an answer.
MIRIAM: He gets more curious about his kids, and less sure that having an answer means having the best one. And he starts to recognize a voice inside himself that he wants to quiet.
SETH: Let's not go straight to that judgy place. Like I don't like that judgy voice inside my head that's judging me all the time and telling me I'm wrong, I'm not good enough, I'm not trying hard enough, making me feel ashamed, making me feel blamed.
MIRIAM: Seth doesn’t just extend that voice externally. He talks to himself with that voice of judgement too. It accuses him: you’re not good enough. It demands: try harder. And he catches how easily he turns it on someone else. Seth and his wife keep working on how they respond. And, slowly, things start to shift.
SETH: So we're reinforcing it with one another, and we're not only seeing the impact on our relationship, where each of us is saying, like, you talk to me like this now, and you used to talk to me like that, and that's made a real difference. We're witnessing how each other is handling situations that arise with our children.
MIRIAM: The change happens in small moments that keep repeating: how they talk to each other, how they connect with their kids. They learn to notice those moments together. Make room for generosity of spirit, and less judgement. And another lesson from the retreats starts to permeate. He can need something, and he can ask for it.
SETH: And just allowing yourself to be taken care of in these ways, allowing yourself to have a need and say, Hey, I'm cold. Can you take care of me is in and of itself a big deal.
MIRIAM: Miriam the prophetess learns this too. Later in the Torah, she speaks harshly about her brother Moses in judgement. As a consequence, God strikes her with an illness that forces her to leave the community camp alone. Moses, the brother she judged, prays for her in five Hebrew words, the shortest prayer in the Torah: El na refa na lah. God, please, heal her, please. And the whole people refuses to move on without her. They wait for her. Judgment pushes her out, and love brings her home.
SETH: the notion of you're doing this with someone else who's there to look out for you and care for you and make sure that you're comfortable and make sure that you're safe. You know, at this place where we were going, it was very much like that was a piece of the, the healing of it was, you know, "Raise your hand if you need a blanket or if you need more water or you need to, go to the bathroom, and someone's gonna come over and help you walk over there."
MIRIAM: The man who’s used to leading the room asks for a blanket. He lets others care for him. Before long, Seth is looking after other participants himself. Then friends ask him to help lead a weekend gathering. He teams up with another facilitator, and together they build a Jewish frame for the experience. They choose Shabbat.
[MUSICAL TRANSITION]
MIRIAM: Planning a Jewish gathering is Seth’s home turf. He knows how to prepare, how to welcome people, how to guide a group. He’s got his set list, and shabbat paraphernalia. This is where he is most comfortable. But, this time, there are two new factors. 1) There are psychedelic drugs involved. And 2) He strives to hold on to his learnings from his own visions around judgement, and what he demands of himself. Turns out, he’s up for the challenge. This is Seth’s new sweet spot. He starts to lead more gatherings, and over time he stops needing to prove he’s succeeding. He also starts to push back on a phrase people use for what they’re doing: journey work.
SETH: This notion of Shabbat as a day of stopping working and so much of it's called like journey work. Like people talk about it like that, like, you're doing the work. And I was like, what does it look like if we don't frame it like that? What does it look like if we talk about you're doing the rest? You're doing the relaxation.
SETH: You're doing the reflection. Like it's not the six days a week of creation that you're engaging in here. It's the seventh day of I don't need to accomplish anything else right now. I've done enough. Like I've I'm I've succeeded. I've gotten to this point. And now I can let myself be cared for. I can focus on letting go. I can release places of tension.
MIRIAM: Remember the man on the lawn chair, asking what he was getting out of it? Judging how little his expectations mapped on his lived experience? Now he hands himself, and everyone with him, a different assignment: stop measuring the moment by what it produces. Shabbat gives him the language to grant that permission.
The rabbis say that in Miriam’s honor, a well follows the Israelites through the wilderness and gives them water for forty years. And Pirkei Avot tells us a story of the very last things created in the story of creation, in the twilight on the first Friday, just as the work of creation winds down and Shabbat begins, God created Miriam’s well. The water that keeps a people alive doesn’t come from the six days of making. It springs up at the threshold of rest.
SETH: And so it's good enough for God to say, I can say I've done enough. Like, how do we allow that for ourselves and say, I don't need to make changes in myself. I don't need to make changes in the world. Everything is okay as it is right now.
MIRIAM: After one retreat, a facilitator asks him what he teaches in his non-retreat life. Seth answers: I teach children to love God. The facilitator pushes back. Seth has also been talking about his anger at God and his uncertainty about what he believes. How can he teach a love he can barely name?
SETH: And I was like, whoa, how can I say that? Like, is saying like I'm teaching love God, is that just, you know, a line? Or do I really mean that?
MIRIAM: He keeps asking. The word God comes more easily now, even as its definition stays open. During our interview, our producer Joey asks him directly.
JOEY: do you love God?
SETH: Yeah, I I think I have learned learned to love God and learned that I do love God.
MIRIAM: Seth thinks about the V’ahavta, the words he has taught for years: love God with all your heart, all your soul, all your strength, and carry that love through every hour of the day. Now he hears them as a question aimed at himself. What is he bringing into the world?
SETH: I think about it as a challenge to me of am I going into this world with love being my fundamental what I'm putting out there? Like if all of this experience is God, every piece of it, how do I? It's it's the counterpoint to the witnessing, right? It's the I witness.
SETH: And I respond with love. Like that's the back and forth. I witness what's happening, like Miriam is witnessing Moses, and I love unconditionally. I love this baby no matter what's going to happen next. You know? And it's not even a question about like faith or hope, like I will love God if Moses is delivered. It's like I am just gonna sit here and be by this basket with my heart full of love for this baby and being present in every way in this moment to see what's gonna come next.
MIRIAM: On the river Nile, what happens next is that Pharaoh’s daughter comes down to the river and opens the basket revealing the baby. And the sister who has been standing at a distance steps forward. “Shall I go and get you a nurse from the Hebrew women?” she asks. Then she runs and brings back the baby’s own mother.
SETH: be here for my baby sibling in the basket and be here with love, and that's it. That's what I can do, and that's what I must do.
MIRIAM: There's something remarkable about that girl standing beside the Nile. Miriam has no promise the story will end well. She has no assurance that the baby in the basket will survive... but, she refuses to look away. And when the moment comes, she steps forward. Perhaps that's what love asks of us... to remain present to a world whose future we cannot know and to take part in what happens next."
[Theme Music]
MIRIAM: Big thanks to Seth for sharing his story. Seth is a Jewish educator, song leader, husband, and father who is learning to bring more curiosity, less judgment, and an open heart to the people he loves. Thank you to our generous sponsors, Barbara and Mathew z”l Loonin for making Everyday Mystics possible. Everyday Mystics is a production of the Institute for the Next Jewish Future, and part of the family of podcasts of Judaism Unbound, hosted by me, Miriam Terlinchamp, produced by Joey Taylor, sound engineering by Justin Newton, original podcast music by Ric Hordinski and art by Katie Kaestner. As always, we'd love to hear from you. Please email us at hello@judaismunbound.com if you have an Everyday Mystics story that you’d like to share.
